Heroes and killing.

[Tetragrammaton]

Marvel has always had it's Punisher and Wolverine characters who killed on a regular basis to get the job done.

Seems to me that within the last few years or so, that just about every Marvel hero has become more and more willing to kill. During Civil War, the heroes manage to get dozens of people killed in their own crossfire. Before this, even my own fan-boy favorite, Iron Man goes on a mind-controlled rampage and kills literally thousands of people. The Hulk certainly killed his fair share before and during Planet Hulk. Now, it seems Spider-Man has been pushed to the point where he is out for blood.

Is this just realistic and I'm behind the times?

Does this bother anyone else?

[Twoguns-Crowley]

From a realistic standpoint, I can see the value in killing certain people, not that I like it. But, being that this is all fantasy, if Batman would just kill the Joker, it would save tons of lives but make for some boring comics. Kill off to many and there is nothing left to fight. I have always thought non deaths were a touch unrealistic, like the old GI Joe cartoon, they would shot down a plane but make sure to show the pilot ejecting and a parachute open, thats not realistic but this is fantasy. Man, now I'm rambling, does it bother me, not at first but I think overall and long term, limit the death.

[CessnaDriver]

I think this stuff comes in waves, goes in and out of fashion so to speak over the years.

[JLM]

I've always liked the trend that (most) superheroes usually find a way of getting the job done without killing - seems more noble.

On the other hand characters should develop, and if a character like Spider-Man gets pushed hard enough, there's no reason why they shouldn't "break".

Given that the Hulk is supposed to be uncontrolled rage, I've always thought that those unlucky enough to cross his path are likely to be killed or seriously injured, either directly, or in the collateral damage Hulk causes.

[risingstar]

In general, I always thought that it was the killing component that separated heroes from villains... Otherwise, Marvel becomes the world of DC's Kingdom Come where no one cares.

Comics keep getting grittier, sleazier, and closer to NC-17 ratings all the time. It's turned me off as a reader, mostly anyway. I'm also concerned about what the comics industry is going to be like in 20 years because it doesn't seem like the people leaving the hobby are being replaced by younger readers. Comics storylines have become so drawn out (taking forever to get anywhere), it takes away from the enjoyment too.

I miss the 80s comics. At the time, virtually every title was worth reading...

:(

[Juggernaut]

There will be more killing or at leat more gutting.

Everyone else probably already knows about the next female heroine that will be gutted and maybe killed?

[imthkman]

In general, I always thought that it was the killing component that separated heroes from villains... Otherwise, Marvel becomes the world of DC's Kingdom Come where no one cares.

Comics keep getting grittier, sleazier, and closer to NC-17 ratings all the time. It's turned me off as a reader, mostly anyway. I'm also concerned about what the comics industry is going to be like in 20 years because it doesn't seem like the people leaving the hobby are being replaced by younger readers. Comics storylines have become so drawn out (taking forever to get anywhere), it takes away from the enjoyment too.

I miss the 80s comics. At the time, virtually every title was worth reading...

:(

You've pretty much summed things up for me as well. Society has become more violent, and the writers are incorporating this for realism. Problem is, comics aren't real, and that's not why I read them. (Although I don't read many any more, due to recent storylines.)

[TheJoker]

Killing a character is a ploy to boost sales... i mean this is the world of comics and everybody comes back to life with the exception of Uncle Ben and Bruce waynes parents.

[Juggernaut]

BTW.

Yeah there is too much killing and blood in the Marvel comics.

It's okay thet Punisher and Wolverine does the killing and the blood is okay in there comic's too. Also in the Moonknight comic's.

Just keep it out of Spiderman and the Avengers and so on.

I miss the days where a comic book was "Just a comic book" What I mean by that is, that comic's today has some how lost it's innocense. Where you could get a good portion of quality action, good VS Evil without any blood spilled.

[lord odin]

I`m a big fan of death and killing always have been.
As for killing in comics it doesn`t bother me.

[Vince-Vell]

im not a fan of direction comics are going with all the killing. Im sure its what sells these days, but i wont pay for it.

i was always a fan of the heros going against unbeatable odds and pulling together for that one last fight to save the day. More or less why i got into comics. Story endings like Avengers Forever, Onslaught (when the heros sacrificed to save the day) and AoA when the x-men went into that final battle.

Now stuff like Civil War has turned me away from comics. i want it to be fun and fantasy, not as realistic as possible with blood spilled all the time.

[Jack8022]

Not being a fan of the Punisher/Wolverine character-type, I'm in the camp where superheroes should not kill. In doing so, they take that step towards being no better than supervillains they fight.

Pushed to the brink... Uncontrolable rage... Seething for vengance... blah blah blah... It's still supposed to be a kid's medium and giving "justified" motives for killing doesn't belong in it. A Spiderman raging about how he's going to kill and looking for vengance is a poor excuse for a hero.

And on the other side of the coin... In more reasonable days, the Kingpin's man would've been stopped before he took the shot or missed. Spiderman can still be out for the shooter who threatened his family (but without the bloodlust).

Bringing in too much real life violence into the books also kills the fun as well as the characters. It also desensitizes readers to real world violence. I was never a fan of the comic-code, but these recent storylines are the rationale why something like it is needed.

[Spatial.Archite]

I suppose my position is that of Devil's Advocate here as I don't mind the Hero killing when it's justified (as long as it's not a ploy to sell more issues). Not that I am for killing, or that it's something I advocate, but I've always believed that comics are at their best when they reflect current events and become a commentary for the society that we live in. That's why I was such a big fan of Civil War; it reflected the U.S.' own internal Civil War that we're fighting over our freedoms.

I like that the hero comes out on top and defies the odds, but I also want violence and war to be portrayed as it truly is. People die, and it's not fair or right, I'm not a big fan of media that glorifies war; there are purposes behind wars, and many times they're definitely needed, but they're never something in need of glorification.

I don't think comic violence desensitizes anyone to real-world violence; the real world desensitizes us to violence in other forms. It's much more difficult to get your point across anymore... to get people's attention so they understand what you're trying to say. At one time you could shock people by beating the snot out of a villain, that just doesn't cut it anymore. We see that every day, "you can't just tap people on the shoulder anymore..."

[VaultMan]

I think there should be those characters who kill, and its just what they do Frank, Wolvie) and some heroes who are just reckless, and cause collateral deaths during their rampage (Hulk). Then there are some who are willing to do whatever it takes in the heat of battle, which includes killing (Diana, Hawkman come to mind).

However, I like the fact there are some heroes who just dont kill (a la Batman). I think it makes for more noble -and consistent- characterization. I think having Spider-Man potentially kill someone is just another "strike" against the consistency of his character. What would Uncle Ben say about Peter becoming a killer? has Peter all of a sudden forgotten about his mantra "woth great power comes...yada yada?" This is kind of like the crappy decision of Peter revealing his identity to the world. Just against not consistent with his character.

What ever happened with that by the way? Havent really heard anything of late.

More from the House of (bad) Ideas.:thumbsdow

[MrYac]

i always thought it was incredibly unrealistic to believe that the Hulk has never killed anybody....

[CocoPUFF]

Marvel has always had it's Punisher and Wolverine characters who killed on a regular basis to get the job done.

Seems to me that within the last few years or so, that just about every Marvel hero has become more and more willing to kill. During Civil War, the heroes manage to get dozens of people killed in their own crossfire. Before this, even my own fan-boy favorite, Iron Man goes on a mind-controlled rampage and kills literally thousands of people. The Hulk certainly killed his fair share before and during Planet Hulk. Now, it seems Spider-Man has been pushed to the point where he is out for blood.

Is this just realistic and I'm behind the times?

Does this bother anyone else?

Actually, when they killed Captain America, I wanted to kill someone!:mad:

[Makkari1]

This is just the writers responding to the market. Wolverine and Punisher are just doing what we all wish Batman would do to the Joke and other like him. But this would make for bad writing (already got that) and all series would wrap up by years end.

There is too much in the blurring of the lines between good guy/ bad guy.

[rychehitman]

i always thought it was incredibly unrealistic to believe that the Hulk has never killed anybody....

agreed!

For that matter...these "super-villians", and "evil mutants" dont kill that many innocent people

[whd]

I wasn't a big fan of how the rest of the X-Men all started to become more and more like Wolverine back in the 80's. Storm became ruthless for awhile and Colossus snapping necks for example. Later they shifted back to behaving more like heroes, but it took some time.

I guess it's just one of the themes that all the hero characters have to work through. The writers like to see how far over the edge they can push these characters, before they recover and return to 'normal'.

[Roguewarrior]

Marvel has always had it's Punisher and Wolverine characters who killed on a regular basis to get the job done.

Seems to me that within the last few years or so, that just about every Marvel hero has become more and more willing to kill. During Civil War, the heroes manage to get dozens of people killed in their own crossfire. Before this, even my own fan-boy favorite, Iron Man goes on a mind-controlled rampage and kills literally thousands of people. The Hulk certainly killed his fair share before and during Planet Hulk. Now, it seems Spider-Man has been pushed to the point where he is out for blood.

Is this just realistic and I'm behind the times?

Does this bother anyone else?

I hear you. I did not know about Ironman killing thousands though. I will have to see how Spiderman is handled. It could be that he is just after the one who shot his Aunt. He may have a dramatic realization (yet again) that "with great power..."

[Devils Drifter]

BTW.

Yeah there is too much killing and blood in the Marvel comics.

It's okay thet Punisher and Wolverine does the killing and the blood is okay in there comic's too. Also in the Moonknight comic's.

Just keep it out of Spiderman and the Avengers and so on.

I miss the days where a comic book was "Just a comic book" What I mean by that is, that comic's today has some how lost it's innocense. Where you could get a good portion of quality action, good VS Evil without any blood spilled.


I agree, it's just wrong to see Spidey killing. That's what the darker charchters are there for.

- DD

[Roguewarrior]

I agree, it's just wrong to see Spidey killing. That's what the darker charchters are there for.

- DD

I think we just found what would make Spidey turn to his darker side! Quite frankly I dont blame him.

[deaconbluezzz]

I think we just found what would make Spidey turn to his darker side! Quite frankly I dont blame him.

Peter Parker...for all his bluster...will not actually kill anyone because he's too much of a pu$$y. Oh, his Aunt's possibly fatal injury makes it okay for him to kill? What about all the folks that the Green Goblin, or Venom, or Carnage have actually murdered? They aren't as important? Please. This is one of the fundamental problems I have with Spider-Man...he always whines and moans about how he's finally been "Pushed too far!" and then he backs off. We've all seen it a dozen times.