Which character would you like to see get killed off?

[grandpa]

Which character would you like to see get killed off?
Either dead is dead or just for some time period since they could use a break.

[Azrael1]

Which character would you like to see get killed off?
Either dead is dead or just for some time period since they could use a break.


Sentry...just Sentry with no hope of resurrection at all.

*** UPDATE***

I'd also like to include the Red Hulk on that list as well. I honestly didn't think I could hate a character as much or more than Sentry but Marvel did it with the creation of the Red Hulk. Good job guys!!!!

[Collection King 13]

Wolverine...

[Alex655321]

Gambit

[nbr3bagshotrow]

Dazzler.... and then the thread goes too.

[Immovable Blob]

Sentry; let him burn in the fires of a Billion Billion suns.

On the flipside I want Sabertooth back.

[Sledge Hammer!]

+1 to the Sentry must die brigade. :D

[HalJordanFan]

Wolverine or Dazzler. I good with either.

[rilynil]

Dazzler hasn't had a big presence in comics in a long time (or ever?). I'm not sure her death would be noticed that much by comic readers.

[Merlose]

Green Lantern, Batman, Wolverine, Hobbits, the Blob, the Vision, Sentry

[Primal]

Green Lantern, Batman, Wolverine, Hobbits, the Blob, the Vision, Sentry

http://img359.imageshack.us/img359/2672/goodriddancegs6.jpg

[Merlose]

Yeah the Hulk needs to be killed off too.

[Primal]

Yeah the Hulk needs to killed off too.

LOL

[Merlose]

I'd also love to see Magus,Optimus Prime, and Nimrod be destroyed!:confused2

[Bartholomew]

Emma Frost NEEDS TO DIE- home wrecking, faked haired, plastic boobed skank who is being shoved down our throats while all the strong x-women have been shoved off into limbo or worse.
Examples:

1) Phoenix/Jean- gone and barely returned for Endsong and "left" again :(
2) Storm- married off to BP, gone from the X-Men for a while, and a shell of her former self now that she's back
3) Rogue- Emma probably appeared in X-Men more than Rogue did, and that was Rogue's team. She spent like a year in a coma, and hasn't been seen much since
4) Kitty- sent off on a magic bullet
5) Psylocke- pretty irrelevant these days

Aside from Emma the Frostitute, I'd like to see Sentry, Rachel Grey, and Red Hulk bite it. Maybe put them all in a ship and send it into a black hole.

End. ;)

[nbr3bagshotrow]

Green Lantern, Batman, Wolverine, Hobbits, the Blob, the Vision, Sentry
:bawling:

[Merlose]

:bawling:

:tounge:

[imthkman]

Red Hulk. Otherwise he's going to kill off every hero in the Marvel Universe.

[krec99]

Red Hulk. Otherwise he's going to kill off every hero in the Marvel Universe.

agreed hate the red hulk

[rilynil]

Green Lantern, Batman, Wolverine, Hobbits, the Blob, the Vision, Sentry

:laugh: You're just peeved because there's not a lot of Dazzler love in the thread. But let's be honest here: Dazzler has never been an A-list hero, and you can't really count her even as an A-list mutant. Sure, I know Fred Dukes is not a first-string villain, but I don't pretend that he is. Dazzler was much-hated among general X-Men fans when she was first introduced, and a lot of people have never found a reason to change their minds. I'm not being mean, I'm just stating a fact.

[Primal]

I'd also love to see Magus,Optimus Prime, and Nimrod be destroyed!:confused2

:laugh: Now you're hitting below the belt LOL

[rilynil]

Emma Frost NEEDS TO DIE- home wrecking, faked haired, plastic boobed skank who is being shoved down our throats while all the strong x-women have been shoved off into limbo or worse.
Examples:

1) Phoenix/Jean- gone and barely returned for Endsong and "left" again :(
2) Storm- married off to BP, gone from the X-Men for a while, and a shell of her former self now that she's back
3) Rogue- Emma probably appeared in X-Men more than Rogue did, and that was Rogue's team. She spent like a year in a coma, and hasn't been seen much since
4) Kitty- sent off on a magic bullet
5) Psylocke- pretty irrelevant these days

Aside from Emma the Frostitute, I'd like to see Sentry, Rachel Grey, and Red Hulk bite it. Maybe put them all in a ship and send it into a black hole.

End. ;)

:( I actually love Emma Frost. She's a unique personality in the Marvel universe when she's written correctly (as Whedon did). She can be a grade-A b----, and I think that's great!

[glassdancer]

WOLVERINE!!!!

[Merlose]

:laugh: You're just peeved because there's not a lot of Dazzler love in the thread. But let's be honest here: Dazzler has never been an A-list hero, and you can't really count her even as an A-list mutant. Sure, I know Fred Dukes is not a first-string villain, but I don't pretend that he is. Dazzler was much-hated among general X-Men fans when she was first introduced, and a lot of people have never found a reason to change their minds. I'm not being mean, I'm just stating a fact.

No not really, you're just stating a fact according to you. :rolleyes2 Sure she's not A-list but that crap about being much hated among X-Men fans that's just something you pulled out of thin air.

[rilynil]

No not really, you're just stating a fact according to you. :rolleyes2 Sure she's not A-list but that crap about being much hated among X-Men fans that's just something you pulled out of thin air.

Nope, that fact is not pulled out of thin air at all. I was around as the Claremont/Byrne series came out month by month. I remember. I think if you poll people about the weakest point of the Claremont/Byrne run (which is the best the X-Men have ever been), that the introduction of Dazzler, which was forced on the creative team as a corporate tie-in, would receive most of the votes. At the time of her introduction, most people did find her lame. A mutant who uses her powers to give herself a lightshow to help her singing career ... that's not exactly the stuff of which legends are made.

So it IS absolutely a fact that many people have never gotten past Dazzler's lame debut. How can anyone doubt it? If she were more popular, she would have been used in comics more consistently in the past few decades

['Nuff]

Aunt May

[protector2814]

All these new kid-Avengers could buy the farm. I'm having a tough time keeping score on who's who with them. Power Pack can bite it. Thin out the X-Men while their at it.

[Merlose]

Nope, that fact is not pulled out of thin air at all. I was around as the Claremont/Byrne series came out month by month. I remember. I think if you poll people about the weakest point of the Claremont/Byrne run (which is the best the X-Men have ever been), that the introduction of Dazzler, which was forced on the creative team as a corporate tie-in, would receive most of the votes. At the time of her introduction, most people did find her lame. A mutant who uses her powers to give herself a lightshow to help her singing career ... that's not exactly the stuff of which legends are made.

So it IS absolutely a fact that many people have never gotten past Dazzler's lame debut. How can anyone doubt it? If she were more popular, she would have been used in comics more consistently in the past few decades

Ummm you mean like a solo title for 4 years and then being part of the x-men for 5 years after that? :rolleyes2 Yeah the facts according to you are really just washed over with your opinion. Sure she's not popular as Thor, Wolvie or the other heavy hitters nobody is saying that but Marvel would have hardly published a title that was not profitable let alone continue to use a character that wasn't popular in the X-Men and Excalibur for such a long period of time. Oh what's that? they're bring her back for the new arch of X-Men. Umm yeah soooooooo hated by X-Men fan. Sure not there are quite a bit of haters but to say that most X-Men fans hate her is really your opinion Neil. :rolleyes2

[Sledge Hammer!]

Yes, death to Power Pack!

[Merlose]

Yes, death to Power Pack!

Killing children? that's scandalous!

[Bartholomew]

:( I actually love Emma Frost. She's a unique personality in the Marvel universe when she's written correctly (as Whedon did). She can be a grade-A b----, and I think that's great!

The snarkyness was amusing at first and ok in low doses. But after several years of it now it's wearing thin. Not to mention that it seems like all the main x-women were pushed out in one way or another so they can push her in.

[bat_collector]

Sentry!

[glassdancer]

Devil Dinosaur and Moonboy.

[rilynil]

Ummm you mean like a solo title for 4 years and then being part of the x-men for 5 years after that? :rolleyes2 Yeah the facts according to you are really just washed over with your opinion. Sure she's not popular as Thor, Wolvie or the other heavy hitters nobody is saying that but Marvel would have hardly published a title that was not profitable let alone continue to use a character that wasn't popular in the X-Men and Excalibur for such a long period of time. Oh what's that? they're bring her back for the new arch of X-Men. Umm yeah soooooooo hated by X-Men fan. Sure not there are quite a bit of haters but to say that most X-Men fans hate her is really your opinion Neil. :rolleyes2

You're not reading what I'm writing, Merlose. Show me where I said "Most X-Men fans hate her" (please note that sentence is in the present tense). Here's what I said:

Dazzler was much-hated among general X-Men fans when she was first introduced, and a lot of people have never found a reason to change their minds.

That statement is absolutely true. Dazzler absolutely was indeed generally hated among X-Men fans when she was introduced because her creation was perceived as an obvious misstep in what had been an unbelievable run of comics. There was a disco backlash in full swing, and the entire concept of Dazzler was based on that scene, obviously. She was not embraced at all. Even some of the Marvel people involved in her introduction have said she was not a good decision. And as I said, many X-Men fans have never found a good reason to change their opinion.

The current miniseries "1985" has done an excellent job, IMO, of capturing what the comic book scene was like in 1985, five years after Dazzler's introduction. Here's a scene with the series' main character wanting to buy a copy of "Secret Wars." The comic-shop owner's response is very representative of the feeling at the time:

http://i85.photobucket.com/albums/k42/nadams65/photos%202/DSC03885.jpg




To be honest, in the comics world, I believe there is more apathy today about Dazzler than anything else. One thread does not a revolution make.

[rilynil]

Devil Dinosaur and Moonboy.

:rolleyes2

[Dan_Lebou]

Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine!

I feckin' hate Wolverine!

[HalJordanFan]

Devil Dinosaur and Moonboy.




:buttrock:

[HalJordanFan]

Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine!

I feckin' hate Wolverine!



Thank god I'm not alone! :D

[Dan_Lebou]

Thank god I'm not alone! :D

Nope but we all had to go underground because Marvel put out a contract on anyone who had a bad thing to say about him.

Expect a knock on the door and a bullet through the eye at any moment!

[Merlose]

To be honest, in the comics world, I believe there is more apathy today about Dazzler than anything else. One thread does not a revolution make.

All that panel proves is that if he didn't order that comic book the next best thing he could get is Dazzler. Hmmm I think it would be hard for any title to compete with one of the first MU cross overs, so second best isn't too bad if you ask me.

No its not a general fact Neil, its a general fact as you want to precieve it. One fan's opinion about something he doesn't care doesn't equate to facts. :rolleyes2

[ratchet]

Sue Storm

[Merlose]

Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine! Wolverine!

I feckin' hate Wolverine!

How about you throw in his clone sister as well?

[rilynil]

All that panel proves is that if he didn't order that comic book the next best thing he could get is Dazzler. Hmmm I think it would be hard for any title to compete with one of the first MU cross overs, so second best isn't too bad if you ask me.

So you perceive that panel as saying that Dazzler was the second-best comic available at the time? Sorry, I believe that panel is making a joke out of the fact that Dazzler comics were oh-so-easy to find because they weren't selling well.

No its not a general fact Neil, its a general fact as you want to precieve it. ****One fan's opinion about something he doesn't care doesn't equate to facts. ****:rolleyes2

It's not just one man's opinion. I remember the general response to Dazzler at the time (not just my own response).

If you're saying I can't relay what seemed to be the majority reaction to a character's introduction at the time, that means that I can't say "General response to Sentry has been poor," or "Wolverine was a big hit in the Byrne years of X-Men" or "Most fans don't seem to like Morrison's cat-Beast" or "Disco started to become strongly ridiculed in the late 1970s" or "Rob Liefeld fell out of favor after the 1990s." Of course, I can make those statements because all of them are true! So I stand by my statement that public reaction to Dazzler was poor.

I know you don't want to admit any criticism of Dazzler, but I was there. I remember the reaction. I've heard negative comments off and on for the 28 years since. Sure, she has some fans, but those don't seem to form the majority of comic book readers. Trust me, Dazzler was a hard, hard sell in 1980.

[Argonus]

It's no secret a lot of people on Statue Forums dislike the Dazzler thread. I find it amusing that half of you don't even visit it to find out it's more than just about Dazzler in there, though. :) Although, yes, she's the topic that brought us all together, either as fans of hers, or supporters OF her fans.

I think the thinly-veiled animosity so many people have on here for the frequenters of that thread (of which, yes, I am a part of) is ill-placed. It's a damned thread.. on a message board, for crap's sake. There's about ten "regulars" in there, and we do discuss Dazzler to great length, as well as other topics. It's amusing how seriously some of you take this stuff, let alone how adamantly opposed, let alone angry, you get over other people's opinions if they differ from your own on whether or not a statue should be made. Go outside and toss a football with some friends, or take your wives to a movie or something.. haha. Spend that pent-up energy productively.

This isn't directed at Neil, by the way. If his Blob thread was still around, I'd still be in there also. Luis is definitely in the "same boat of crazy" that Neil is (it's a "good" crazy, don't get me wrong... haha. I'd sell my wife's China for a Caiera statue done by Bowen, at this point... ) To be fair, Randy's given more acknowledgement to a Blob being produced than a Dazzler anyways, and kick-@ss for that, unfortunate if he's been scratched... but you'll get your Blob over time, much like we'll get Dazzler. One way or another.

We're all here for the same reason. So, some of you hate Dazzler? So what? I don't like every character everyone else likes, but I don't stomp on them for their individual tastes being different than my own. Crazy-talk, I know.

Feel free to disagree with me, as just mentioning the phrase "support Dazzler" will have some of you in a rabid state of being, I'm sure. :)


To be honest, in the comics world, I believe there is more apathy today about Dazzler than anything else. One thread does not a revolution make.

[Merlose]

So you perceive that panel as saying that Dazzler was the second-best comic available at the time? Sorry, I believe that panel is making a joke out of the fact that Dazzler comics were oh-so-easy to find because they weren't selling well.



It's not just one man's opinion. I remember the general response to Dazzler at the time (not just my own response).

If you're saying I can't relay what seemed to be the majority reaction to a character's introduction at the time, that means that I can't say "General response to Sentry has been poor," or "Wolverine was a big hit in the Byrne years of X-Men" or "Most fans don't seem to like Morrison's cat-Beast" or "Disco started to become strongly ridiculed in the late 1970s" or "Rob Liefeld fell out of favor after the 1990s." Of course, I can make those statements because all of them are true! So I stand by my statement that public reaction to Dazzler was poor.

I know you don't want to admit any criticism of Dazzler, but I was there. I remember the reaction. I've heard negative comments off and on for the 28 years since. Sure, she has some fans, but those don't seem to form the majority of comic book readers. Trust me, Dazzler was a hard, hard sell in 1980.

:rolleyes2 only thing you've proven is that you like to make assumptions based on your own truths. I can accept that she's not one of the popular characters doesn't mean I see the world according to Neil. Just because you've read comics for X amount of years doesn't mean that your assumptions forum the majority of readers. :rolleyes2

[Doctor Pym]

At the risk of de-hijacking the thread, I want to say...

CARNAGE.

And all of his symbiote brethren, cousins, half-sisters, great-aunts and brothers-in-law twice removed.

The Sentry had the right idea when he flew Cletus into orbit and ripped him in half. Too bad he didn't STAY that way.

[rilynil]

It's no secret a lot of people on Statue Forums dislike the Dazzler thread. I find it amusing that half of you don't even visit it to find out it's more than just about Dazzler in there, though. :) Although, yes, she's the topic that brought us all together, either as fans of hers, or supporters OF her fans.

I think the thinly-veiled animosity so many people have on here for the frequenters of that thread (of which, yes, I am a part of) is ill-placed. It's a damned thread.. on a message board, for crap's sake. There's about ten "regulars" in there, and we do discuss Dazzler to great length, as well as other topics. It's amusing how seriously some of you take this stuff, let alone how adamantly opposed, let alone angry, you get over other people's opinions if they differ from your own on whether or not a statue should be made. Go outside and toss a football with some friends, or take your wives to a movie or something.. haha. Spend that pent-up energy productively.

This isn't directed at Neil, by the way. If his Blob thread was still around, I'd still be in there also. Luis is definitely in the "same boat of crazy" that Neil is (it's a "good" crazy, don't get me wrong... haha. I'd sell my wife's China for a Caiera statue done by Bowen, at this point... ) To be fair, Randy's given more acknowledgement to a Blob being produced than a Dazzler anyways, and kick-@ss for that, unfortunate if he's been scratched... but you'll get your Blob over time, much like we'll get Dazzler. One way or another.

We're all here for the same reason. So, some of you hate Dazzler? So what? I don't like every character everyone else likes, but I don't stomp on them for their individual tastes being different than my own. Crazy-talk, I know.

Feel free to disagree with me, as just mentioning the phrase "support Dazzler" will have some of you in a rabid state of being, I'm sure. :)

Good post, Argonus! :thumbs2: You're a good man! You're talking for the most part on a subject other than Dazzler's level popularity when she was introduced ... but you are talking about a subject that has been around the forum for an age now. Here are a few thoughts I'd like to offer:

My blood doesn't boil at the mention of Dazzler. I really don't care if Dazzler gets produced by Bowen or not. I can say the same for dozens if not hundreds of other characters, too.

But I do admit that I get annoyed by how Dazzler seems to be introduced (by the same few people) into what seems to be 75 percent of the threads on the forum. Yes, I mounted a big campaign for the Blob months and month ago. But I eventually let it rest. Only recently have I started dropping a few Blob mentions here and there. I have never wanted to come across as a guy with only one character on his mind or one opinion in his head. Eventually, every town crier gets a rock thrown at his head.

Even Al doesn't beat the same drum indefinitely any more (yay, Al! You're my bud! :thumbs2:). Of course, he catches all kinds of hell when he posts a little too often on wanting a "metallic blue Captain America" and such. Nothing wrong with having minority tastes, but no one likes to read the same stuff over, and over, and over, and over. Truthfully, that's the way it seems with Dazzler sometimes (and I'm not talking about the thread. That's a separate issue. I'm talking about obsessively working Dazzler into completely unrelated threads).

Maybe I'm wrong, but I think the majority of the ire Dazzler draws on the forum is because of repetition.

[rilynil]

:rolleyes2 only thing you've proven is that you like to make assumptions based on your own truths. I can accept that she's not one of the popular characters doesn't mean I see the world according to Neil. Just because you've read comics for X amount of years doesn't mean that your assumptions forum the majority of readers. :rolleyes2

Thanks for sidestepping all the points I made. Nothing like keeping a debate supported, Merlose. Do also disagree that Sentry is unpopular, or disco became ridiculed, or cat-Beast is disliked?

[Merlose]

Thanks for sidestepping all the points I made. Nothing like keeping a debate supported, Merlose.

I didn't side step any of your points at all, you made the same damn point you made last time, you're assuming a general feeling towards something based on your opinions. No not all the general readers feel the the way that you or your friends do, you're seeing things from one skewed point, you're making general statements bases on gripes i'm sure you or your friends have made. I know just as many people who love Dazzler as hate her, I know just as many people that love Beast's new forum as hate it..... the point is fans are always going to be divided by these kind of things hence once again you're making your "general" statements by what ideas that you choose to surround yourself by.

[Merlose]

Do also disagree that Sentry is unpopular, or disco became ridiculed, or cat-Beast is disliked?

Have you heard the expression:" to make an assumption is to make an a$$ of you and me" I don't have a problem with you disliking Dazzler because I know there are people that do.... I'm simply saying that you like to make to many assumptions that you're holding as fact.

[rilynil]

Have you heard the expression:" to make an assumption is to make an a$$ of you and me" I don't have a problem with you disliking Dazzler because I know there are people that do.... I'm simply saying that you like to make to many assumptions that you're holding as fact.

I'm talking about popular opinion. Actually, I'm apathetic about Dazzler, because I've never seen anything in her character that hooks me.

[touche22]

I stopped buying books last year, but I would say if there was a "character I would like to see killed off" it would be a character whose death would spatk a huge response and or storyline bombs. That being said, the next character death I'd like to see would be either Sue Storm or a murdered Franklin Richards. The FF hasn't had tragedy in the family as say the X-Men or the Avengers have. You know they can be brought back as every other character has, but make it compelling.
Other than that I'd say Vision.....oh, wait....already blown up.
OK, Blob.......oh, wait....he might already be dead since he's already rendered usless by being a bag of skin. :laugh:
Sorry Neil, had to do it after you've been pounding on Merl! :laugh:

[HoldyourfireAl]

Without a doubt...SENTRY! The day Quesada leaves office, I want to see someone with balls just have Sentry ripped apart!

[Merlose]

I stopped buying books last year, but I would say if there was a "character I would like to see killed off" it would be a character whose death would spatk a huge response and or storyline bombs. That being said, the next character death I'd like to see would be either Sue Storm or a murdered Franklin Richards. The FF hasn't had tragedy in the family as say the X-Men or the Avengers have. You know they can be brought back as every other character has, but make it compelling.
Other than that I'd say Vision.....oh, wait....already blown up.
OK, Blob.......oh, wait....he might already be dead since he's already rendered usless by being a bag of skin. :laugh:
Sorry Neil, had to do it after you've been pounding on Merl! :laugh:

:laugh:

[rilynil]

I didn't side step any of your points at all, you made the same damn point you made last time, you're assuming a general feeling towards something based on your opinions. No not all the general readers feel the the way that you or your friends do, you're seeing things from one skewed point, you're making general statements bases on gripes i'm sure you or your friends have made. I know just as many people who love Dazzler as hate her, I know just as many people that love Beast's new forum as hate it..... the point is fans are always going to be divided by these kind of things hence once again you're making your "general" statements by what ideas that you choose to surround yourself by.

My main point in this thread was that the reaction to Dazzler was negative when she was introduced. I'm talking about general public opinion. If you know that Dazzler was universally beloved when she was introduced, please fell free to correct me. And I've also offered my opinion that there are many more people today that are apathetic about Dazzler than are huge Dazzler fans. I freely admit that that's my opinion.

Similarly, I can say that the Rocket Racer was widely ridiculed when he first appeared in Amazing Spider-Man. How can I say that? I remember my reaction. I remember reading the comic book letters pages for months afterward. And I have for decades since read and heard many of the same things about the character. I know this just as I know that Carter was seen as a wimp by many, grunge music killed hair bands in the mainstream and Bush's popularity has waned. I'm not saying that EVERYBODY hated Rocket Racer, that EVERYBODY saw Carter as wimp or that EVERYBODY thinks Bush has done a bad job. I'm talking about what was/is perceived as a general opinion. Do you understand the concept? Maybe that's where we're not connecting.

[rilynil]

I stopped buying books last year, but I would say if there was a "character I would like to see killed off" it would be a character whose death would spatk a huge response and or storyline bombs. That being said, the next character death I'd like to see would be either Sue Storm or a murdered Franklin Richards. The FF hasn't had tragedy in the family as say the X-Men or the Avengers have. You know they can be brought back as every other character has, but make it compelling.
***Other than that I'd say Vision.....oh, wait....already blown up.
OK, Blob.......oh, wait....he might already be dead since he's already rendered usless by being a bag of skin. :laugh:
Sorry Neil, had to do it after you've been pounding on Merl! ****:laugh:
:laugh: Good one! But actually Fred Dukes appeared on the opening page of this past month's Uncanny X-Men 500 (without extra skin!) and the Young Avengers' Vision is alive and well in the Secret Invasion No. 5 that came out today. So not all is lost! :thumbs2:

[Merlose]

Similarly, I can say that the Rocket Racer was widely ridiculed when he first appeared in Amazing Spider-Man. How can I say that? I remember my reaction. I remember reading the comic book letters pages for months afterward. And I have for decades since read and heard many of the same things about the character. I know this just as I know that Carter was seen as a wimp by many, grunge music killed hair bands in the mainstream and Bush's popularity has waned. I'm not saying that EVERYBODY hated Rocket Racer, that EVERYBODY saw Carter as wimp or that EVERYBODY thinks Bush has done a bad job. I'm talking about what was/is perceived as a general opinion. Do you understand the concept? Maybe that's where we're not connecting.


No I don't think YOU are connecting, again you're making too many assumptions. Yes your friends didn't like said thing, and some readers wrote in said they didn't like said thing. Most people that write in are people who want to complain. So really you're still choosing to make a general statement based on one set of opinions which are reinforced by your own opinion. That's like saying I believe in ghosts....my friends believe in ghosts and the neighbors believe in ghosts therefore the general population believes in ghosts. :rolleyes2

[Merlose]

:laugh: Good one! But actually Fred Dukes appeared on the opening page of this past month's Uncanny X-Men 500 (without extra skin!) and the Young Avengers' Vision is alive and well in the Secret Invasion No. 5 that came out today. So not all is lost! :thumbs2:

What good is a skinny Blob?

[rilynil]

No I don't think YOU are connecting, again you're making too many assumptions. Yes your friends didn't like said thing, and some readers wrote in said they didn't like said thing. Most people that write in are people who want to complain. So really you're still choosing to make a general statement based on one set of opinions which are reinforced by your own opinion. That's like saying I believe in ghosts....my friends believe in ghosts and the neighbors believe in ghosts therefore the general population believes in ghosts. :rolleyes2

Nope, that's not even close to being the same thing.

I think you just don't like me saying that Dazzler was an unpopular character when she was introduced. I freely admit that it seemed that most people hated X-23 when she was introduced. Heck, many people still do because they can't get past the "clone" thing. But if I believe X-23 is a great character, and you believe Dazzler is a great character, what's the big deal?

[Merlose]

Nope, that's not even close to being the same thing.

I think you just don't like me saying that Dazzler was an unpopular character when she was introduced. I freely admit that it seemed that most people hated X-23 when she was introduced. Heck, many people still do because they can't get past the "clone" thing. But if I believe X-23 is a great character, and you believe Dazzler is a great character, what's the big deal?

Isn't it though...... I'm not even talking about your like or dislike about a character just pointing out that facts aren't made by one set of people believing that they're fact based on their opinions and the opinions around them.

[touche22]

Nope, that's not even close to being the same thing.

I think you just don't like me saying that Dazzler was an unpopular character when she was introduced. I freely admit that it seemed that most people hated X-23 when she was introduced. Heck, many people still do because they can't get past the "clone" thing. But if I believe X-23 is a great character, and you believe Dazzler is a great character, what's the big deal?

Neil, that is exactly the point. Everyone is entitled to like their own character, I think Merl is just getting tired of all the people on the "I hate Dazzler" bandwagon because they know it'll get a laugh on the board. As you might have seen in my above post, I stated the reason for my "killed off" choice. I think some people just say "Dazzler" just like (and I know you know the reference) everyone thought it was funny at one point in the 80's to say "Where's the Beef???"

[Barbarian]

Friggin' Supes... once, and for all.

[rilynil]

Merl, I had a good response to your last post about the Blob not being in Uncanny 500, and you changed your post! :banghead: I was going for the knock-out punch but you left the ring! :laugh: :thumbs2:

[touche22]

Friggin' Supes... once, and for all.

God forbid......DC will replace him with 10 clone/robot/protege/skrull/twin with a goatee/2nd cousin twice by marriage!!!

[touche22]

Merl, I had a good response to your last post about the Blob not being in Uncanny 500, and you changed your post! :banghead: I was going for the knock-out punch but you left the ring! :laugh: :thumbs2:

I got to read it before you changed it! :laugh:

[rilynil]

Isn't it though...... I'm not even talking about your like or dislike about a character just pointing out that facts aren't made by one set of people believing that they're fact based on their opinions and the opinions around them.

No, you're right in that public opinion does not make facts, BUT the fact of public opinion exists.

[rilynil]

I got to read it before you changed it! :laugh:

Man, it was a GOOD one, too! :laugh:

[Barbarian]

God forbid......DC will replace him with 10 clone/robot/protege/skrull/twin with a goatee/2nd cousin twice by marriage!!!

Too true. Too tue, indeed. :)

[Merlose]

No, you're right in that public opinion does not make facts, BUT the fact of public opinion exists.

Well now you're just going back on what you said, you said that: so and so was fact because of public opinion and now you're acknowledging that there is a difference between public opinion and fact which is the point I was trying to make. So wait does that mean I won? I'm confused.....what are we even arguing about now?

[rilynil]

Neil, that is exactly the point. Everyone is entitled to like their own character, I think Merl is just getting tired of all the people on the "I hate Dazzler" bandwagon because they know it'll get a laugh on the board. As you might have seen in my above post, I stated the reason for my "killed off" choice. ***I think some people just say "Dazzler" just like (and I know you know the reference) everyone thought it was funny at one point in the 80's to say "Where's the Beef???"****

Yep, I know that expression well! I was being paid by that company when it was popular! :laugh:

And yep, I completely understand Merlose's frustration. And I understand the other side, too. There's so much drama to wade through! ;)

[Merlose]

Merl, I had a good response to your last post about the Blob not being in Uncanny 500, and you changed your post! :banghead: I was going for the knock-out punch but you left the ring! :laugh: :thumbs2:

Sorry I typed before I thought it out. :p But then I quickly remembered about the stuff before the costume party about him being a weight loss guru in Japan because how could I forget something I rolled my eyes at so hard?
But wait a minute....... he didn't lose the weight on his own!! He's a FAKE!!! Weighloss guru my aunt Fanny.

[rilynil]

Well now you're just going back on what you said, you said that: so and so was fact because of public opinion and now you're acknowledging that there is a difference between public opinion and fact which is the point I was trying to make. So wait does that mean I won? I'm confused.....what are we even arguing about now?

:laugh: Man, we are DEEP in the rabbit hole now! No, what I was saying was that the popular public opinion at the time of Dazzler's debut was that she was extremely unpopular, although my comments are not universally popular with the forum's population and may not win me any popularity contests. That's all. :) But really, I didn't say the popular opinion at the time was correct, I just said the opinion was popular, therefore, it's a fact that Dazzler was unpopular at the time, which is no reflection on her true worth.

Damn, I'm good. :rolleyes2

[rilynil]

Sorry I typed before I thought it out. :p But then I quickly remembered about the stuff before the costume party about him being a weight loss guru in Japan because how could I forget something I rolled my eyes at so hard?
But wait a minute....... ****he didn't lose the weight on his own!! He's a FAKE!!! Weighloss guru my aunt Fanny****

That's why he's a villain! He's not to be trusted! :laugh:

[touche22]

Wow....imagine if Dazzler looked the way she was originally pitched....like a bald Storm in a Dazzler costume!!!!

[Merlose]

:laugh: Man, we are DEEP in the rabbit hole now! No, what I was saying was that the popular public opinion at the time of Dazzler's debut was that she was extremely unpopular, although my comments are not universally popular with the forum's population and may not win me any popularity contests. That's all. :) But really, I didn't say the popular opinion at the time was correct, I just said it was popular, therefore, it's a fact that Dazzler was unpopular at the time, which is no reflection on her true worth.

Damn, I'm good. :rolleyes2

Oy here we go again...... your 'therefore' statement is powered by opinion and ending in fact.....WTF?

[rilynil]

For the record (considering this is the thread's true topic), I vote for no character to be killed off because I'm tired of characters being killed off. Not even Dazzler. :)

[touche22]

Wabbit season......duck season.......wabbit season.......duck season.

[Merlose]

For the record (considering this is the thread's true topic), I vote for no character to be killed off because I'm tired of characters being killed off. Not even Dazzler. :)

Amen to that....... too many pointless deaths at the hand of Ed Brubaker (my opinion not a fact or general statement concluding to fact) It seems the vogue thing to do to kill characters you didn't create early in your career at Marvel.

[Wesley Pierce]

For those of you who hate wolverine, you should check out Uncanny X-Men annual #11.

I hate the character, but this was a great story. Unfortunately, it's everything that came after this that ruined the character for me.

As for which character would I like to see killed off...

None. There has been far too much of this in recent years. Moreso than in any other era. Not only this but the character deaths of the past actually stood for something. There was a great deal of meaning put into them and long lasting repurcussions. Unfortunately now, deaths and rebirths/skrulls/dreams/reality shifts occur far too often and with little or no meaning behind them.

[touche22]

Oooooooooooooooooooooooooooo, can I add I'd like Aunt May to finally die of old age! She's gotta be like 200 years old!!!! She's not Wolverine or Yoda, just go "night night" already!!!!

[Merlose]

Oooooooooooooooooooooooooooo, can I add I'd like Aunt May to finally die of old age! She's gotta be like 200 years old!!!! She's not Wolverine or Yoda, just go "night night" already!!!!

Golden Oldie will never die because she has the power cosmic!

[rilynil]

Oy here we go again...... your 'therefore' statement is powered by opinion and ending in fact.....WTF?

Let's come at it from this direction: there exists times when a person's lack of popularity is a fact.

Example 1, this is a fact today: Bush is unpopular in America and the world.
Example 2, this was a fact in 1980: Dazzler's introduction was not well received.

Merl, are you just yanking me around to see how many times I'll restate my position? :confused: I admit that plays like this hit me in my blind spot usually. :laugh:

[Wesley Pierce]

Can we just start a dazzler thread instead of fighting it out in this one?

[Wesley Pierce]

Golden Oldie will never die because she has the power cosmic!

LOL.. WHAT IFs were great. I'll take some supersized golden brownies any day.. lol

[glassdancer]

:rolleyes2

you KNOW I'm just teasing, Neil, right......???

That was just my being bratty for the bust coming out is all.

Cheers, bud!

[twoferflinchin]

Batman. I want to see a villain use "prep time" to take him out too.

[rilynil]

you KNOW I'm just teasing, Neil, right......???

That was just my being bratty for the bust coming out is all.

Cheers, bud!

I figured you were kidding, but I decided to give an "eye roll" anyway! :laugh: :thumbs2: No worries!

[RichBamf]

Comic death is so used up right now, I don't want to see anyone die for a while. Some well told personal tragedy is always as touching as someone dying anyway.

[Dan_Lebou]

Comic death is so used up right now, I don't want to see anyone die for a while. Some well told personal tragedy is always as touching as someone dying anyway.

Nope. I want some full on death! Real 'Never coming back - EVER' death. Something that has genuine meaning!!!

Get a writer/company/editor that has some balls to use a popular character to do something meaningful that results in them perishing and then have it written in stone that nobody is to EVER bring the character back again. They can refer to the character in flashbacks, can have other characters mention them and refer to things that they did whilst they were still alive but NEVER actually have them come back to life.

Colossus was the perfect example - until they brought him back. Wankers!!!!

[rilynil]

Batman. I want to see a villain use "prep time" to take him out too.

:laugh: The all-important "prep time!"

[Teague]

At the risk of de-hijacking the thread, I want to say...

CARNAGE.

And all of his symbiote brethren, cousins, half-sisters, great-aunts and brothers-in-law twice removed.

The Sentry had the right idea when he flew Cletus into orbit and ripped him in half. Too bad he didn't STAY that way.

This is the first post in this thread that I can 100% agree with. :D

[sleepindeath]

Dazzler
The Sentry
Red Hulk
Spawn
Green Lantern Corps

[Raven1014]

Honestly...none. I'd like to see some of the creators that kill these characters actually create something fresh and see if that characters can get a following.

Who is the last really good character introduced in the X-universe in the last 10 years? Maybe a couple of the Hellions are OK, but nothing spectacular yet. But we've had Morrison kill off Jean Grey again almost for the sake of just doing it.

Same thing in Spider-Man. What was the point of having Sentry kill Carnage? To show how superior Sentry is? I have yet to find anyone that really likes the Sentry and now they are introducing another Venom/Carnage type character into the Spidey mythos again.

You don't like a charter, don't write about him. Show some skill as a writer and create something fresh and let that character build up a following. Then if you want, kill off your creation for a reaction.

[boobhound]

I don't read comics anymore, but I would like a few characters to be killed off. An I mean dead an done, no coming back, ever!!!!!
1. CABLE I frikkin hate CABLE!!!!!
2. SENTRY
3. all of the YOUNG AVENGERS
4. POWER PACK

And I'm a gonna weigh in on th Dazzler thing. I'm not a rabid fan of Dazzler. Never was, never will be. I do want a white (Disco?) jumpsuit version of Dazzler in bust form!!!! She needs to be busted, along with Valkyrie, Ms. Marvel, an Enchantress!!!!

[marvelboi77]

Queen Veranka, or whatever the hell her name is. But I have a feeling I'm going to get my wish very soon.:p

[riderV3]

cat beast

[Relic]

Everyone that has died in the past should stay dead or die again and remain dead....
jean grey
green lantern
superman
etc.

[Dan_Lebou]

Everyone that has died in the past should stay dead or die again and remain dead....
jean grey
green lantern
superman
etc.

Too right. That way, if a writer wanted to kill a character off then they'd best be damn sure that it is a bloody good reason/story to do so.