Swamp Thing Maquette

[SDguy]

Originally Posted by Gothamite

That's due to poor engineering rather than the materials used, though.

Plus, if a polystone statue ends up leaning, imagine what a plastic statue will do with poor engineering.

Exactly my point.

[sharpnel]

I see those are up and arms about PVC and vinyl. That was my first reaction. Just reading and listening to those who have experienced with the materials, I'm not too concern at this point. I'm sure Sideshow is fully aware. We have the buying power to express our opinions. For me, I will sit tight, wait and see how Swamp Thing will look in hand. This could be a big change in the industry from ploystone to PVC. I'm in support of the change for the better.

From my experienced with custom kit and factory statues, I have had many instances of chipping, paint cracks and items broken in deliveries. This material is very brittle and fragile which contributes to defects of the product. I'm all for it if something better comes along. Anyway if some are fans of weighted statues, I don't see why the can't add a bit of weight to give a nice qualify feel.

[Sandman585]

Originally Posted by Parallax

Skeletor has a lot of PVC on him and looks amazing. People tend to ignore that. Good Smile's TMNT line is all PVC and even though it's tiny they look amazing. Raphael that just released from Sideshow has PVC sai and they look identical to Leonardo's metal katanas. Armored Batman has a PVC grenade launcher that looks like it's made of real metal. Aquaman's trident and hook hand are PVC. I understand the argument that it's a different material and won't be heavy and all that. I'm not going to pretend I'm not a little bummed that it's not polystone, but at the same time, it really doesn't matter. As I've stated time and time again, I'm not paying for the materials, I'm paying for the work that goes into it. Paul sculpted this by hand, I've seen it in person and the sculpt is jaw dropping. I don't want any of that detail to be lost so the statue can be heavier. I also don't want to sacrifice that detail to increase the risk of so many small parts breaking. Thanos' chair is detailed but it's not as many tiny pieces as Swamp Thing. It doesn't have little vines and tendrils and tendons or whatever they are raised off the skin with a gap between them like Swamp Thing has on his arms, hands, legs, and feet. I just don't believe there is a way to replicate this statue in polystone and have it look as good as it does right now.

Unfortunately this was the thought process for Predator and it didn't turn out well according to those who received one. I'm with you and I am all for making sure detail is preserved but ultimately if it looks and feels cheap sacrificing some detail is worth it for $800 plus dollars.

Also, unless we know what the prototype was cast in there is no way to accurately state that polystone would be inferior.

[Parallax]

Originally Posted by Sandman585

Unfortunately this was the thought process for Predator and it didn't turn out well according to those who received one. I'm with you and I am all for making sure detail is preserved but ultimately if it looks and feels cheap sacrificing some detail is worth it for $800 plus dollars.

Also, unless we know what the prototype was cast in there is no way to accurately state that polystone would be inferior.

Polystone just factually doesn't grab as much detail as a vinyl mold would. We're talking silicone casts vs metal casts in terms of accurately transferring the detail and then we're taking about which material can pick up and hold more details.

[Sandman585]

Originally Posted by Parallax

Polystone just factually doesn't grab as much detail as a vinyl mold would. We're talking silicone casts vs metal casts in terms of accurately transferring the detail and then we're taking about which material can pick up and hold more details.

I'm with ya man. In theory it all sounds great but capturing EVERY detail may not be worth it. Its a sum of all of the parts concept I think in this situation. And I will still argue that until they come out and say that prototype that was at the conventions was vinyl I'm assuming it was a traditional cast and that shows this statue can be done that way. Now, if production pics and in-hand pics look and FEEL outrageously good I for one could care less of the material. From the video of Wolf Predator below the track record is just not there. This video is where I unfortunately think we will land with this statue and is quite telling of the limitations of the vinyl
I would have rather paid more money for a cool green resin or polystone. Quite frankly Alec deserves it and so does Paul who brought him to life.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_q2erHJ-ezs

[HeavyMetalSpike]

Anyone who thinks that using silicon molds along with polystone & resin mixes does not provide superb detail would be wrong.

By all means use vinyl/PVC for thin or extra-fragile add-on parts - but there's simply no need for that in the vast majority of sculpts.

Anybody with knowledge/experience of molding & casting kits knows that claims about "better detail transference" are Sadshow spin - pure and simple.

.

[Choopie]

I think that using PVC to capture detail is a flawed argument, especially when the base is resin, and detailed, and when Thanos, for example, is resin and is detailed, especially the throne. I guess they wanted to cut down on breakages using vinyl, but I'd rather see them invest in quality packaging and still stick to poly. They used to use it: anyone remember the foam inserts for some of their Star Wars PFs like Han Solo?

I just don't feel that Sideshow is at the level of using vinyl to produce a quality product for the price they are asking. They are not Blitzway. They dabbled with translucent resin years ago and gave it up when they couldn't achieve what they were going for, when other companies had mastered it. There's no shame in not being able to keep up with the Joneses. Stick to what you are good at.

As long as they continue down this road, I'm not interested. But what does my decision matter anyway? It's not stopping them from raising their prices or choosing to use material that I don't want. I'm the only one whose losing out on this.

[Iko Iko]

Originally Posted by Parallax

I'm not going to pretend to know what everything costs and since I don't know the price differences between polystone and vinyl/pvc I can't really make a fair statement on the cost, but $400-$500 is very cheap for something of this size and detail. Just about everyone here was expecting around $1200 for this statue. Do you think switching from polystone to vinyl saves $400 per statue? Absolutely not. Polystone statues are marked up. PVC statues are marked up. For example, say each of these statues costs $500 to make. If people are fine with a $700 markup for it to be made of polystone, I don't see why a $300 markup for PVC and vinyl (and still a polystone base) is so hard to fathom.

Thanks for answering my question and yes, I don't pretend to know the costs of these statues either. What I do know is that Kotobukiya puts out some pretty nice 1/6 scale PVC statues and they are pretty detailed AND they are only in the $120 range. Again, this one is very detailed and larger BUT is the step up from 1/6 to 1/4 and with additional attention to detail worth $700 more? I don't know but that seems rather dramatic to me.

[Gothamite]

Originally Posted by Iko Iko

Thanks for answering my question and yes, I don't pretend to know the costs of these statues either. What I do know is that Kotobukiya puts out some pretty nice 1/6 scale PVC statues and they are pretty detailed AND they are only in the $120 range. Again, this one is very detailed and larger BUT is the step up from 1/6 to 1/4 and with additional attention to detail worth $700 more? I don't know but that seems rather dramatic to me.

I've sold almost all of my Koto statues because there's no way to avoid the warping/leaning/melting/"sweating" problems associated with their use of plastic.

[Parallax]

Originally Posted by HeavyMetalSpike

By all means use vinyl/PVC for thin or extra-fragile add-on parts - but there's simply no need for that in the vast majority of sculpts.
.

Well the thing is Swamp Thing is one solid piece so it's all or nothing. I'd rather have a solid, uniform statue than bad seams and pieces that might not look the same when painted.