Just when Sideshow was winning me back!

[risingstar]

Originally Posted by Enforcer

LOL. You know, I often saw/see this on eBay from sellers who advertise new product but then ship you used crap and then try to offer you a partial refund to get you to keep the item you didn't order to begin with.

Maybe not poor CS, but it's a poor business practice that shouldn't be dismissed just because you can return for refund. For some people it's not that simple...

For such a large company and the leader in this field, I would expect them to afford the measly yearly income of an additional QC person or two. I know they have a ton of product but even the most basic amount of QCing effort would have caught this during quick inspection.

This is my take on this... Does Sideshow want to produce and distribute product with obvious paint flaws and defects? Of course not. Do they know which statue will have production flaws in advance? I don't generally think so. Are they aware that a percentage of statues may sometimes ship with QC issues? I imagine they do but they invest in the risky venture anyway because that's just part of the nature of the business, and if we're to be honest, the good far outweigh the bad so the odds are favorable. No statue company is exempt from the box-of-chocolates aspect of the statue production business. And, Sideshow either can't or won't inspect every single piece off the assembly line. Even if they did, lots can still happen once the piece is put in the box and shipped from China.

I think most fans know that they will not get what they see in the prelim - but if all goes well, we can get in the 80% range, sometimes even 90%, and that's generally good enough, at least for me. On one side of the spectrum, you have stunning statues like Batgirl, Venom, Joker, and Darth Talon, and on the other side, you have statues like Rogue and the Man of Steel. IMO, the majority of pieces turn out well, so what is the real problem?

Up until the point of shipping, fans have agreed to price, design, scale, wait-time, so there's no justifiable kvetching about any of those things once the NRD was paid. However, it's in the "what happens when things don't go well" area when problems with fans begin... Case in point, the recent Spiderman PF with the reported flaws by a percentage of clients (i.e., splochy paints, glued back-on broken fingers). While I highly doubt Sideshow would ever want to intentionally send out anything with issues like that, nor can we be sure exactly how much they knew in advance about the quality of their release prior to shipping and didn't troubleshoot, it's just as important to note that today's fans know when their justifiable concerns appear to be dismissed or minimized. They know a subpar product when they see one. For some, the $30 "we're not outright admitting this didn't come out right but yes, that doesn't look right" credit often serves just to add salt to the wound. So who is responsible? What's the best and most realistic (not ideal) solution?

At the end of the day, you need to be happy with your purchase. Sure, it's disappointing to have to return a piece or request a refund for a piece you wanted, especially when you see others with a better QC than yours, and especially if the piece seems to be still available on the Sideshow website, but that's the Russian Roulette of buying statues, especially those with a high ES.

There will always be another statue on the horizon to strike your fancy -- or, you can always wait for a nicer Spidey PF to be offered up for sale by another collector. Not the ideal solution, I know, but as collectors, we need to concentrate on the areas we can control and that will always begin and end with how we choose to spend our money.

[nbr3bagshotrow]

Originally Posted by Josh-a-tron

You are assuming its a large percentage. I asked once what their overbuy on parts is, the answer I got was 1.5%. Granted that was a few years ago, but 1.5% is only enough replacements for about 35 statues. That means at 2% damages they are out of parts. Now thats not a high percentage of damages but when on this forum we see 10 people complain about issues loudly all of sudden things get blown out of proportion and people start saying things like "a large percentage of shoddy work" when in reality is a very small percentage that get damages and an even smaller percentage that can't get further replacements. It still sucks for thise that can't get what they need but lets not pretend like the forums are the a huge percentage of statues sold.

Bingo, and they probably also figure they may have to eat some profit if the defect rate is more than the percentage of extra pieces they produce for replacing defected pieces.

[nbr3bagshotrow]

Originally Posted by risingstar

This is my take on this... Does Sideshow want to produce and distribute product with obvious paint flaws and defects? Of course not. Do they know which statue will have production flaws in advance? I don't generally think so. Are they aware that a percentage of statues may sometimes ship with QC issues? I imagine they do but they invest in the risky venture anyway because that's just part of the nature of the business, and if we're to be honest, the good far outweigh the bad so the odds are favorable. No statue company is exempt from the box-of-chocolates aspect of the statue production business. And, Sideshow either can't or won't inspect every single piece off the assembly line. Even if they did, lots can still happen once the piece is put in the box and shipped from China.

I think most fans know that they will not get what they see in the prelim - but if all goes well, we can get in the 80% range, sometimes even 90%, and that's generally good enough, at least for me. On one side of the spectrum, you have stunning statues like Batgirl, Venom, Joker, and Darth Talon, and on the other side, you have statues like Rogue and the Man of Steel. IMO, the majority of pieces turn out well, so what is the real problem?

Up until the point of shipping, fans have agreed to price, design, scale, wait-time, so there's no justifiable kvetching about any of those things once the NRD was paid. However, it's in the "what happens when things don't go well" area when problems with fans begin... Case in point, the recent Spiderman PF with the reported flaws by a percentage of clients (i.e., splochy paints, glued back-on broken fingers). While I highly doubt Sideshow would ever want to intentionally send out anything with issues like that, nor can we be sure exactly how much they knew in advance about the quality of their release prior to shipping and didn't troubleshoot, it's just as important to note that today's fans know when their justifiable concerns appear to be dismissed or minimized. They know a subpar product when they see one. For some, the $30 "we're not outright admitting this didn't come out right but yes, that doesn't look right" credit often serves just to add salt to the wound. So who is responsible? What's the best and most realistic (not ideal) solution?

At the end of the day, you need to be happy with your purchase. Sure, it's disappointing to have to return a piece or request a refund for a piece you wanted, especially when you see others with a better QC than yours, and especially if the piece seems to be still available on the Sideshow website, but that's the Russian Roulette of buying statues, especially those with a high ES.

There will always be another statue on the horizon to strike your fancy -- or, you can always wait for a nicer Spidey PF to be offered up for sale by another collector. Not the ideal solution, I know, but as collectors, we need to concentrate on the areas we can control and that will always begin and end with how we choose to spend our money.

Spoken like someone who really understands the collectible statue market. If you don't like it, then spend $1000 to $1200 for an XM statue ( which still doesn't guarantee a flawless product).

[Peedi]

This statue arrived with a defect that was neither a shipping accident nor the customer's fault. It should be replaced. If there's no replacement, they should have the customer wait until there is one. Produce more replacements, Lord knows they never have enough. Not that simple? Because bottom line: money.

I know some of our opinions will differ on this and that's fine. I've been in this boat with ss too many times and I'm extremely hesitant on ordering from them again right now because I keep experiencing things like this. I also understand that most people DON'T have these experiences.

[Josh-a-tron]

Originally Posted by Peedi

This statue arrived with a defect that was neither a shipping accident nor the customer's fault. It should be replaced. If there's no replacement, they should have the customer wait until there is one. Produce more replacements, Lord knows they never have enough. Not that simple? Because bottom line: money.

I know some of our opinions will differ on this and that's fine. I've been in this boat with ss too many times and I'm extremely hesitant on ordering from them again right now because I keep experiencing things like this. I also understand that most people DON'T have these experiences.

Well it isn't that simple and you're right it is a money issue. When you give a factory a run you give them, or at least in my line of work, tooling, it's a set up cost to have the casting or cutting or sanding implements to make a large run. Once the run is finished including any replacement parts in a percentage of the original run the machines/tooling are broken down so the next piece in line can be set up and made. If you need more the factory will ask for another set-up cost, and then in order for you to actually make it worth your while you'd have to produce another run.

Since Sideshow sets an edition size to their products another run is pointless and waste of money, not to mention if they suddenly produced another run and sold them these boards would turn into nuclear fire ball of hate and venom. So basically it makes more sense to eat 10-20 returns than to produce another run of 3,000 statues and replacement parts.

Does it suck? Yes. Is it going to stop? Nope.

[Collectorcol]

Originally Posted by tonytiger

That's funny i just got e-mail with their shipping label for ups return and they want the badly painted body back before they send me the new replacement body.

Strange. I've always had destroy requests.

Originally Posted by Josh-a-tron

You are assuming its a large percentage. I asked once what their overbuy on parts is, the answer I got was 1.5%. Granted that was a few years ago, but 1.5% is only enough replacements for about 35 statues. That means at 2% damages they are out of parts. Now thats not a high percentage of damages but when on this forum we see 10 people complain about issues loudly all of sudden things get blown out of proportion and people start saying things like "a large percentage of shoddy work" when in reality is a very small percentage that get damages and an even smaller percentage that can't get further replacements. It still sucks for thise that can't get what they need but lets not pretend like the forums are the a huge percentage of statues sold.

Totally depends on the statue in question. Some suffer more issues/complaints than others.
You're trying to tell me Big Chap LSB, QotD & Iron Patriot Maquette (most IM pieces) have a small percentage of returns?

Exactly right, forums are a very small percentage of statues sold, so when there are multiple issues you can bet that piece has well known issues.

[dao2]

Originally Posted by Josh-a-tron

Well it isn't that simple and you're right it is a money issue. When you give a factory a run you give them, or at least in my line of work, tooling, it's a set up cost to have the casting or cutting or sanding implements to make a large run. Once the run is finished including any replacement parts in a percentage of the original run the machines/tooling are broken down so the next piece in line can be set up and made. If you need more the factory will ask for another set-up cost, and then in order for you to actually make it worth your while you'd have to produce another run.

Since Sideshow sets an edition size to their products another run is pointless and waste of money, not to mention if they suddenly produced another run and sold them these boards would turn into nuclear fire ball of hate and venom. So basically it makes more sense to eat 10-20 returns than to produce another run of 3,000 statues and replacement parts.

Does it suck? Yes. Is it going to stop? Nope.

FYI F4F and Gaming Heads does produce replacements AFTER. So it's not exactly unprecedented.

[derekrodneysim]

Sorry to see that

[COI]

Originally Posted by risingstar

Up until the point of shipping, fans have agreed to price, design, scale, wait-time, so there's no justifiable kvetching about any of those things once the NRD was paid. However, it's in the "what happens when things don't go well" area when problems with fans begin... Case in point, the recent Spiderman PF with the reported flaws by a percentage of clients (i.e., splochy paints, glued back-on broken fingers). While I highly doubt Sideshow would ever want to intentionally send out anything with issues like that, nor can we be sure exactly how much they knew in advance about the quality of their release prior to shipping and didn't troubleshoot, it's just as important to note that today's fans know when their justifiable concerns appear to be dismissed or minimized. They know a subpar product when they see one. For some, the $30 "we're not outright admitting this didn't come out right but yes, that doesn't look right" credit often serves just to add salt to the wound. So who is responsible? What's the best and most realistic (not ideal) solution?

At the end of the day, you need to be happy with your purchase. Sure, it's disappointing to have to return a piece or request a refund for a piece you wanted, especially when you see others with a better QC than yours, and especially if the piece seems to be still available on the Sideshow website, but that's the Russian Roulette of buying statues, especially those with a high ES.

Good post.

[SuperJ300]

Cheers everyone for your opinions!

Great discussion on this topic.

I think I'll need to be careful how many stuff I order as it is hard to get replacements being overseas.

Shipping cost me $40 but custom hit me hard this time £79 as it shipped straight from Hong Kong it says on box.

I've had no problem with getting body replacements from SS until now.