Friends of Northstar 4

[Ink]

Originally Posted by bat_collector

who is watching the vp debate tonight

not me

[JonoJ108]

Originally Posted by bat_collector

I'm happy that he as something that makes him happy. I'm also happy that he likes transformers and likes to work out.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that admire and respect his faith and his adherance to it, even if I do not exactly wish to follow it as he does.

And while I'm nto saying going to this retreat is my first choice, since jeff does stuff with me he doesn't particularly like, I guess I can do the same for him from time to time.

and I gotta say I'm curious what is gonna happen.

As far the debate, I have a bad bad feeling Palin is gonna use the "I'm a woman, look how cute I am when I belittle everybody" trick and people will fall for it.

word. as long as yr happy in yr relationship, the rest of us can go take a leap. it's nice of you to join him on something like this, where you're clearly doing it to support him & spend more time together as a couple. glad you didn't sign up for the Brainwashing Seminar.

i have a feeling Palin may TRY that trick, but there're a lot of sharp-eyed commentators--women especially--who won't let her get away with that. granted her supporters aren't watching a lot of msnbc, but there's nothing to be done w/ folks that vote Republican on party-lines. It's the independents & those who are really voting by the issues who'll decide the election, and i don't think they'll be fooled by more "Joe Six-Pack" blather.

[TNovak]

Originally Posted by JonoJ108

you DON'T have to be Religious to be Moral.

Well that is certainly true. I'm about a 50-50 guy when it comes to Hitchens in general. It seems to me that about 50% of the time he seems smart and insightful while about an equal amount of time he seems like an insufferable pompous blowhard.

I would have figured you for a Buddist or some eastern zen religion Jono. Let's not forget the first two of Budda's four noble truths

1) all existence is suffering

and

2) all suffering is caused by desire

[JonoJ108]

Originally Posted by TNovak

Well that is certainly true. I'm about a 50-50 guy when it comes to Hitchens in general. It seems to me that about 50% of the time he seems smart and insightful while about an equal amount of time he seems like an insufferable pompous blowhard.

I would have figured you for a Buddist or some eastern zen religion Jono. Let's not forget the first two of Budda's four noble truths

1) all existence is suffering

and

2) all suffering is caused by desire

Religion was created by humans either to help or to control other humans and to explain natural phenomena & metaphysical questions for which humans didn't have the sophistication, knowledge, or technology to investigate at the time, no different from the Greek, Egyptian, or Hindu mythologies. Just like the disciplines of Science, Art, and Philosophy, except that these "move with the times" as new discoveries & theories are put into practice & accepted.

I don't see that this recognition really takes anything "vital" from Religion, except the patently absurd idea (more prominent in the Western faiths) that there's an all-powerful, vengeful deity who for some reason won't show Himself.

all existence coming from suffering, and all suffering coming from desire?--sounds pretty on-the-money to me, but i'm not putting on an orange robe & handing out books on the subway.

[TNovak]

Originally Posted by JonoJ108

but i'm not putting on an orange robe & handing out books on the subway.

Don't set yourself on fire either

[JonoJ108]

Originally Posted by TNovak

Don't set yourself on fire either

ok, then.

[bat_collector]

Originally Posted by JonoJ108

don't see that this recognition really takes anything "vital" from Religion, except the patently absurd idea (more prominent in the Western faiths) that there's an all-powerful, vengeful deity who for some reason won't show Himself.

great way to put it jono

I hope you are right about palin too, but I don't have the trust you have.

[JonoJ108]

Originally Posted by bat_collector

great way to put it jono

I hope you are right about palin too, but I don't have the trust you have.

Hitchens makes that point, too, when he rails on the Bible as a "true record," drawing attn to the stories of the Creator of the whole world & universe actively involving Himself in small tribal disputes w/in a few small miles (the Holy Land), but NO mention is made of any place or people that someone of the time/place wouldn't have seen (like Europe or America). Also, where is He now? God supposedly destroyed Sodom & Gomorra for a violation of hospitality customs, but then WW2 happened?

don't even get me started on Mormonism!

[superdoug]

Originally Posted by bat_collector

As far the debate, I have a bad bad feeling Palin is gonna use the "I'm a woman, look how cute I am when I belittle everybody" trick and people will fall for it.

See, if you watched the news, you'd learn that VERY few people are falling for it any more, including a large swath of conservatives. It's very encouraging, if the Democrats don't shoot themselves in the foot, it's Obama's to win.

I want to hear Joe Biden use a statement I used earlier in the week, while dealing with a difficult player on the game where I staff: 'I hope I don't come off mean in this exchange, but I'm tired of sugarfooting around this dumbbell.' (My words were stronger and not very PC.)

[JonoJ108]

Word. it's not just on SNL, either. Palin's taking a beating on the nat'l news, newsmagazines, pretty much every major paper, and of course w/ the pundits & talking heads.

Dan Quayle, pt. 2.