Another Christmas shooting.....

[CessnaDriver]

Originally Posted by dr_teng

Since the NRA has lobbied and successfully had laws passed that made it easier for people with mental health issues to acquire guns, they don't seem terribly interested in addressing mental health issues beyond viewing people with issues as a potential market.

It is extremely rare for anyone with mental health issues to hurt anyone. We have to be careful to not just think anyone with say asbergers or similar is a lunatic ready to kill everyone. There is no evidence supporting that. I don't know the specfics of what the NRA did there, but I imagine it could be that leaving someone who had some mild mental health issues at one time to be left unarmed at the mercy of murdering criminals might be the motivation.


Hey, your in Canada though, is there a concern there how we manage our security here?

[joefixit2]

Originally Posted by CessnaDriver

Again, these killers went to theaters, schools, places they knew that resistance would be little, they didn't choose a gun store, a police station, or even a sporting event where there are armed guards. They chose a place were people are percieved to be the most easy to kill.

so again you are suggesting that we should have guns in schools, restaurants, bars, libraries, coffee shops, department stores...well that sounds like we will have armed people everywhere.

Originally Posted by CessnaDriver

Again, the Oregon mall murderer offed himself when he saw an armed citizen was there.

And you know that how? Did he say something before he killed himself to that effect?

Originally Posted by CessnaDriver

Irratational Hoplophobia (fear of weapons) is not a solution.
It's time to start thinking out of the box and the core problems that bring about these rare instances and the larger sadly common ones we live with each day that get of course no media attention though many more die.

And Irrational tednugetphobia (fear that the government is going to take every single one of your guns away from you in the middle of the night) is not the answer either. As I will say yet again that gun control is not the only answer, it is only part of the solution. And notice I am saying gun control, not gun elimination.

Originally Posted by CessnaDriver

It is extremely rare for anyone with mental health issues to hurt anyone. We have to be careful to not just think anyone with say asbergers or similar is a lunatic ready to kill everyone. There is no evidence supporting that. I don't know the specfics of what the NRA did there, but I imagine it could be that leaving someone who had some mild mental health issues at one time to be left unarmed at the mercy of murdering criminals might be the motivation.

Hey, your in Canada though, is there a concern there how we manage our security here?

Considering I've lived in NYC for almost two years now and I probably travel through more of America on a regular basis than you do, I'd say it's a concern of mine, sure. Nice try at a deflection though.

So despite having no clue what the NRA has lobbied for, you're already backpedaling on your previous statement about improving mental health healthcare? That didn't take much. You should probably look into it as well as the backlash the NRA is receiving now from mental healthcare advocates about their recent statements.

Their contradictory statements about mental healthcare make complete sense when you realize the NRA is merely a lobbying group for the gun industry and has no interest in it outside of new sales.

[CessnaDriver]

Originally Posted by joefixit2

so again you are suggesting that we should have guns in schools, restaurants, bars, libraries, coffee shops, department stores...well that sounds like we will have armed people everywhere.



And you know that how? Did he say something before he killed himself to that effect?



And Irrational tednugetphobia (fear that the government is going to take every single one of your guns away from you in the middle of the night) is not the answer either. As I will say yet again that gun control is not the only answer, it is only part of the solution. And notice I am saying gun control, not gun elimination.

I think were just going in circles on the armed citzenry.
Your already around it, it's happened and done in much of the country. If just a few percent apply and have a CCW, then that is one more citizen has the tool
and training to make a difference. There is nothing to fear about that.


California is already experiencing reductions in firearm rights so it's not a fantasy concern that such legislation will be introduced that is more far reaching so it is a very real and looming concern to the law abiding firearm owners.
"safe handgun roster", "fixed magazines", "magazine limitations", bizarre laws about pistol grips defining a so called "assault rifle" even though it is not full auto. Even our ability to buy ammo online was attacked and thankfully defeated in court.

Citzizens that excercise and hold dear their second amendment rights do have serious concerns as over the years those right have come under attack, some places like NY city are draconian. So it's a real concern.



I can only say imagine if you were limited on 1st amendment rights in a similar fashion?

[CessnaDriver]

Originally Posted by dr_teng

Considering I've lived in NYC for almost two years now and I probably travel through more of America on a regular basis than you do, I'd say it's a concern of mine, sure. Nice try at a deflection though.

So despite having no clue what the NRA has lobbied for, you're already backpedaling on your previous statement about improving mental health healthcare? That didn't take much. You should probably look into it as well as the backlash the NRA is receiving now from mental healthcare advocates about their recent statements.

Their contradictory statements about mental healthcare make complete sense when you realize the NRA is merely a lobbying group for the gun industry and has no interest in it outside of new sales.

Ahh, NYC is one of the most anti-gun place you can live, as is Chicago. Yet guns are still used in crimes.

So you enjoy the United State's liberties yet criticize the way we protect it? Gotchya.


I'm not a walking encyclopedia on everything the NRA does in regards to mental health, and I am debating like what? Three people here when I should be tending to my home and truck oil change. I speak for myself and my views, and the NRA is aligned with me on 90% of things in regards to my rights, of course firarm manufactureres will align with the NRA just as socialists will align with disarming the populace.


There are more articulate then I...


http://larrycorreia.wordpress.com/20...n-gun-control/


And frankly it is exhausting going over and over when some will simply not listen to reason and consider it's not the guns.

[nbr3bagshotrow]

Originally Posted by CessnaDriver

Ahh, NYC is one of the most anti-gun place you can live, as is Chicago. Yet guns are still used in crimes.

So you enjoy the United State's liberties yet criticize the way we protect it? Gotchya.


I'm not a walking encyclopedia on everything the NRA does in regards to mental health, and I am debating like what? Three people here when I should be tending to my home and truck oil change. I speak for myself and my views, and the NRA is aligned with me on 90% of things in regards to my rights, of course firarm manufactureres will align with the NRA just as socialists will align with disarming the populace.


There are more articulate then I...


http://larrycorreia.wordpress.com/20...n-gun-control/


And frankly it is exhausting going over and over when some will simply not listen to reason and consider it's not the guns.

LOL. When someone doesn't agree with a position it's them that's not listening to reason. I'm sure there are others that are thinking the same thing from the opposite side of the fence.

Originally Posted by CessnaDriver

Ahh, NYC is one of the most anti-gun place you can live, as is Chicago. Yet guns are still used in crimes.

So you enjoy the United State's liberties yet criticize the way we protect it? Gotchya.

Another deflection? You should try something else. "You" aren't protecting America's liberties, nor are the NRA. Not understanding the second amendment has little to do with protecting America.

I'm not a walking encyclopedia on everything the NRA does in regards to mental health, and I am debating like what? Three people here when I should be tending to my home and truck oil change. I speak for myself and my views, and the NRA is aligned with me on 90% of things in regards to my rights, of course firarm manufactureres will align with the NRA just as socialists will align with disarming the populace.

You aren't even sure what the NRA does or lobbies for so claiming they're in agreement with 90% of what they do comes off somewhat ignorant. Maybe you should look into it, you might end up supporting one of the actual reasonable second amendment groups rather than one led by conspiracy theorists bought out by the gun industry.

They do exist you know. I enjoy guns but when I see the nonsense that the NRA has spewed forth and made people believe, it's no surprise there's little reasonable room for debate with many gun advocates. Or did you miss the last couple times they sent out knowingly false mailers about the UN confiscating guns in an effort to drum up donations?

[CessnaDriver]

...and also the NRA is not the final world on gun rights organizations. There are many other gun rights organizations.

But they all will be under the common flag of the 2nd amendment.

[CessnaDriver]

Originally Posted by dr_teng

Another deflection? You should try something else. "You" aren't protecting America's liberties, nor are the NRA. Not understanding the second amendment has little to do with protecting America.



You aren't even sure what the NRA does or lobbies for so claiming they're in agreement with 90% of what they do comes off somewhat ignorant. Maybe you should look into it, you might end up supporting one of the actual reasonable second amendment groups rather than one led by conspiracy theorists bought out by the gun industry.

They do exist you know. I enjoy guns but when I see the nonsense that the NRA has spewed forth and made people believe, it's no surprise there's little reasonable room for debate with many gun advocates. Or did you miss the last couple times they sent out knowingly false mailers about the UN confiscating guns in an effort to drum up donations?

I'm not deflecting a damn thing.
Your enjoying American liberties secured from the beginning by the 2nd amendment.

Your also attempting to wrap me in the NRA.
Go take it to them, not with me.

Google up all you like, Im not getting into that kind of discussion.


Off to change oil.

Molon Labe.

[joefixit2]

Originally Posted by CessnaDriver

I speak for myself and my views, and the NRA is aligned with me on 90% of things in regards to my rights, of course firarm manufactureres will align with the NRA just as socialists will align with disarming the populace.

And frankly it is exhausting going over and over when some will simply not listen to reason and consider it's not the guns.

with comments like these I really swear that you are not even reading any other posts. Can you do me a favor and make me feel better and post the following comment: "I Cessnadriver, of sound mind and body, do hereby state that I realize that joefixit2 does not advocate everyone losing their guns but rather gun control which will take some discussion between all those involved. Joefixit2 also believes that gun control is but one of the issues and that there are a number of other issues that need to be address to fix the problem."