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Old 11-11-2014, 05:54 PM   #1
The Mule
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XM General Discussion Thread

Since the "Ask" thread has been flooded with other arguments and (rightfully) the mods asked to bring the talk somewhere else, I thought it could be useful to have a generic thread to discuss of everything.
The XM guys could also use this for sneaks/teases and so on if they prefer to keep the "Ask" thread clean for just the Q&A.
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Old 11-11-2014, 06:25 PM   #2
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Nice idea.

Sure people will still go off on their rants though, just the way of it.

Also for those who don't know it exists and want to continue the XM vs that other company you can go here:

http://www.statueforum.com/showthread.php?t=144483
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Old 11-17-2014, 09:58 AM   #3
Dark Logic
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I don't know if this could happen, but wouldn't it be beautiful if SS and XM could collaborate on a few pieces? Before anyone jumps on me for saying this, allow me to define that...

What I mean is, Ive seen SS collaborate with other companies in regards to marketing and distribution. The other company would usually be responsible for the design and SS would facilitate the piece through there distribution channels and maybe production. I could be mistaken on how this arrangement was structured with past collaborations, but we've seen something similar in the past.

The purpose of this would be for a larger ES, and licensing that spans Asia and U.S.A..with both companies a part of this, Im certain they could work out the licensing details with Marvel legal. Consider it would only be for a few pieces (not a permanent partnership). I know its to late for any pieces already approved, but this is something Id hope could happen in the future. Would make it so much easier to have an XM piece in the U.S.A.

Any thoughts on this?
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Old 11-17-2014, 10:23 AM   #4
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I agree and I thought about it as well.
But there are a couple factors that make me think we won't see this cooperation:

1) Sideshow has never distributed pieces that would be direct competition. They distributed for Bowen and Pop Culture Shock, and keep distributing for ARH and Hot Toys, plus Three A, Electric Tiki and Tweeterhead, if memory serves.
Problem is, none of these are producing or have produced 1/4 Marvel pieces.

2) When distributing, Sideshow has, of course, their share of earning on each product and they also have a margin for negotiating the retail price. I remember that this was confirmed both by Jerry (PCS) and Averone (ARH). That's why PCS decided to sell everything directly a pair of years ago.

If you sum up points (1) and (2), you end with two companies that now are in competition, but divided by different price points and different areas for market. With distribution via Sideshow, they would enter into direct competition, in the same areas and with one of the two that can "interfere" with the retail price of the other.
This basically would be a recipe for disaster. XM would end immediatly their collaboration (I mean, they are already selling out now, even if they upped the ES to 1500 or 2000 they could keep their actual business model and have no need for NA/UE distribution), Sideshow has nothing to gain by direct competition, what they earn for distribution would probably just even out with the hindered sales they would end up with, and customers would just be pissed off about the whole mess.

Maybe I'm just being pessimist but I'm trying to keep at mind that this is a business, first. Companies are in the industry for money and a scenario that would potentially hurt both companies "just" to make more customers happy looks improbable, to me.
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Old 11-17-2014, 10:29 AM   #5
Dark Logic
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Mule View Post
I agree and I thought about it as well.
But there are a couple factors that make me think we won't see this cooperation:

1) Sideshow has never distributed pieces that would be direct competition. They distributed for Bowen and Pop Culture Shock, and keep distributing for ARH and Hot Toys, plus Three A, Electric Tiki and Tweeterhead, if memory serves.
Problem is, none of these are producing or have produced 1/4 Marvel pieces.

2) When distributing, Sideshow has, of course, their share of earning on each product and they also have a margin for negotiating the retail price. I remember that this was confirmed both by Jerry (PCS) and Averone (ARH). That's why PCS decided to sell everything directly a pair of years ago.

If you sum up points (1) and (2), you end with two companies that now are in competition, but divided by different price points and different areas for market. With distribution via Sideshow, they would enter into direct competition, in the same areas and with one of the two that can "interfere" with the retail price of the other.
This basically would be a recipe for disaster. XM would end immediatly their collaboration (I mean, they are already selling out now, even if they upped the ES to 1500 or 2000 they could keep their actual business model and have no need for NA/UE distribution), Sideshow has nothing to gain by direct competition, what they earn for distribution would probably just even out with the hindered sales they would end up with, and customers would just be pissed off about the whole mess.

Maybe I'm just being pessimist but I'm trying to keep at mind that this is a business, first. Companies are in the industry for money and a scenario that would potentially hurt both companies "just" to make more customers happy looks improbable, to me.
I see. But you don't think all that can be worked out before hand where its mutually beneficial for both? Even in some cases limit that 1 piece collaboration to the EU and USA markets? (no offense Asia)
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Old 11-17-2014, 10:51 AM   #6
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If you mean excluding Asia completely, even for a single piece, I'd just think that it's not fair. I'm in Europe and sure as hell I know what it means to be cut off and have to pay inflated prices to get what I want. It's not something I wish would happen to others, especially if it's done "on purpose".

Most of all, I can't see any scenario in which it would be "mutually beneficial for both". Just consider this: even if people seem to keep claiming that XM is too expensive, Sideshow is not *that* far.
Their statues retail somewhere mid 400$ now, when you factor in shipping, final price is very well around 500$. Now, figure Sideshow that receives XM's pieces at wholesale, via sea, it would be more or less like BBTS, but with more discount and better rates. Most XM pieces could easily retail at around $650, at least the "standard sized" ones, like Cap, Ant Man, Hawkeye and the like. Factor in shipping, and you'd end up with 700$ delivered, possibly even less considering that people is getting XM's pieces at that price from BBTS.
The price difference between SS and XM would not be that much, while the quality and design differences would be obvious to the customers.
And add in the speed at which XM teases and produces new characters, especially the most wanted that Sideshow just refuses to make. Sideshow's Marvel line would end up annhilated. This is most surely an unfavorable scenario, for Sideshow. And even for XM, they could probably move their pieces faster, but would earn less on each piece for the distribution fee they'd need to pay to Sideshow.
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Old 11-17-2014, 11:44 AM   #7
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why does XM need Sideshow, they are already selling out, funny seeing US collectors whining about not having something available locally and having trouble ordering ,lol
we international collectors have been going through this for years, even the stuff i bought from SS if i tried selling it on secondary market , i would barely break even even if most of them have gone up in value by quite a bit
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Old 11-17-2014, 11:55 AM   #8
Dark Logic
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dino76m View Post
why does XM need Sideshow, they are already selling out, funny seeing US collectors whining about not having something available locally and having trouble ordering ,lol
we international collectors have been going through this for years, even the stuff i bought from SS if i tried selling it on secondary market , i would barely break even even if most of them have gone up in value by quite a bit
Peace brother. No one needs anyone. This would be one more way some pieces could be available to markets they weren't otherwise. Besides, it was just an idea, dream, fantasy. Were in this together friend. Just trying to be solution oriented in this wonderful hobby. Would you like to suggest how pieces could be more easily available in your market?
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Old 11-17-2014, 11:55 AM   #9
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Well, to be fair, I've been vocal too with US customers about the matter, when I felt that some of them had a demanding attitude towards XM.
I think that Dark Logic is genuinely interested in a collaboration between the companies that would also benefit more customers, more than a simple "I want it in my country I don't want to pay 250$ for shipping!". It makes sense that US customers are interested in the matter and I'm fine with it until the debate doesn't fall into claims and demands.

Just wanted to add that my opinion on the matter, with the scenarios I depicted above, is my personal view of course and based on assumptions. It's what my guts tell me about it.
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Old 11-17-2014, 05:37 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Mule View Post
Since the "Ask" thread has been flooded with other arguments and (rightfully) the mods asked to bring the talk somewhere else, I thought it could be useful to have a generic thread to discuss of everything.
The XM guys could also use this for sneaks/teases and so on if they prefer to keep the "Ask" thread clean for just the Q&A.
Great idea!

I've changed the thread title a bit to better reflect what it is. Hopefully this will help keep the "Ask XM" thread dedicated to the Q&A format.

I've also made this thread "sticky" for easy access.
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