**DAZZLER, AND HER AMAZING FRIENDS**

[glassdancer]

Originally Posted by Argonus

I'm far more Conservative than my wife, but she's still way more "Middle-of-the-Road" than Liberal... you can't discount today's one the history books will remember, Luis... look past his political party for a second.... he's our first African-American President.. that's something that Americans 100 years ago would've never thought could happen.

That being said, tomorrow he's just "another President".. and four/eight years from now, unless a woman's elected, it'll be "business as usual".

Hey Ry-Ry,.....

I love you and all,....but I'm afraid I have to strongly disagree with this statement.

Mainly because your preeceding statement was made.

In fact,....it's BECAUSE he is the first ever African-American President or, non-anglo or non-"ethnic" President that puts him in the "NOT just another President" catagory.

So far, to date,...on the news, in the media, on MTV, on vH1, on BET, etc., etc., etc.....I'm afraid that this particular presidency is coming at just the right time where America has decided as a whole that it is far more important that we follow trends and such to earn and maintain our sense of "belonging," sense of "acceptance" and of course, sense of "appropriateness" in this world more than ever!

We continue to show the rest of the world just how superficial and shallow we are in all of our descision making and once again, we've done so by trying yet another extreme route.

When I Look at our new President, I see nothing but a man who was/is qualified to run or country. Period!

But unfortunately we live in a world where even though we don't want to see that,...we'll undoubtedly be conditioned to see just that it is now "cool" to be President. Well,....at least according to stations such as VH1, MTV and BET. And of course, our younger generation watch and LIVE by the Idols they see on these shows, so of course, what these shows portray MUST be true, and MUST be LAW!!!!!!

Sheesh!!

I'm gonna staop here because I'm tired from the long weekend and I'm afraid that what I'm really trying to say is going to get conveluted and my points are going to come off as something else.

Ugh!!

Politics!!!

This world we live in is so......

I don't know.

[Argonus]

I do have to say, in all fairness, Bush was kinda evasive in his Larry King interview.. that disappointed me.

He did make his point about his main focus after 9/11 being keeping our country safe from another such attack, and he (and the armed forces) succeeded admirably at doing just that. Plus, he created The Dept. of Homeland Security, which probably had something to do with that as well.. a worthwhile addition to our Nation's security, for sure.

[touche22]

Originally Posted by Argonus

You know not just Bush makes all the decisions, though, right, Steve? I don't understand why some people think what Bush says "goes". It doesn't work that way. He's given information, he gives his two cents, people mull over what he says, all the other "houses/checks & balances" in Washington have to give the okay.. then actions are carried out.

Obviously you know Bush isn't the "end-all-be-all decision maker" in Washington.. sure, his hands are dirty from some actions, but what President's hands aren't dirty to a degree?

There's people in place to stop Bush, or curb decisions before they even get to his desk..the fact that some decisions weren't curbed, or were presented poorly, isn't Bush's fault...

That being said, has he made some bad decisions, that weren't curbed? Yes. He also did what he said was his focus for his Presidency, though, and kept our nation safe from another 9/11-type attack.

I'm an adult..as are all of us.. if this turns into a discussion, I'm above arguing about it. Everyone's entitled to their own opinion.

Ryan, as someone who lived in NY during both terrorist attacks(WTC 1993 bombing, 9/11), lost a family member in one of them, and assisted in the cleanup at ground zero finding an occassional body part, I can tell you that the claim of "keeping America safe from terrorist" since 9/11 is a bit overstated. WTC was bombed by terrorists in 1993, then 8 years later in 2001 we were attacked again. No we have not been attacked in 6 1/2 years, but there is clear sentiment around the globe that the Bush/Cheney steamroller has made the US more enemies than allies. I'm not a republican or a democrat, I vote who I think is better for the job. I'm not liberal, but I'm also far from being conservative. One thing I feel has put the country in a bad position has been the religious tone the last presidency ran the country with. There is no place in politics for religion, most war and conflict in the history of the world has been in the name of religion.

[glassdancer]

this is gonna get sticky real fast.

[Argonus]

I understand what you're saying, Luis.. but holding Obama to some "higher standard" than we've held other Presidents to, merely because he's African-American, isn't fair to Obama.. quite honestly.

He's opening the eyes of a lot of people that thought they'd never amount to anything, etc., due to their race/economic status/etc.. that by no means should be downplayed, but we also shouldn't expect the man to fix things overnight, as that's not a fair assumption to be placed on his, or any President's, shoulders.

My wife is seeing him as "JFK'-type of President, and I'd have to agree. The man is someone I could talk to about Bowen Statues, or surfing, and he'd be genuinely interested.. and give his own, engaging input. Then this same man would go to an impoverished neighborhood and try and raise their spirits there through a rally, or efforts to renovate their community center or something.

Obama seems to think big and small... I'm just hoping he continues that line of thinking. All indications point to that he will.

I'm from a military family, and two wealthy families.. even so, even with my supporting of Bush (even though that's lessened hugely the last couple of years).. I totally see the hope a President like Obama brings to so many people in this country, and I'm hardly the person to say it's unwarranted.

This guy being President has uplifted more people than any other candidate I've seen in my lifetime, and that's saying something. His ethnicity is a distant (yet just as significant) second to that.

Originally Posted by glassdancer

Hey Ry-Ry,.....

I love you and all,....but I'm afraid I have to strongly disagree with this statement.

Mainly because your preeceding statement was made.

In fact,....it's BECAUSE he is the first ever African-American President or, non-anglo or non-"ethnic" President that puts him in the "NOT just another President" catagory.

So far, to date,...on the news, in the media, on MTV, on vH1, on BET, etc., etc., etc.....I'm afraid that this particular presidency is coming at just the right time where America has decided as a whole that it is far more important that we follow trends and such to earn and maintain our sense of "belonging," sense of "acceptance" and of course, sense of "appropriateness" in this world more than ever!

We continue to show the rest of the world just how superficial and shallow we are in all of our descision making and once again, we've done so by trying yet another extreme route.

When I Look at our new President, I see nothing but a man who was/is qualified to run or country. Period!

But unfortunately we live in a world where even though we don't want to see that,...we'll undoubtedly be conditioned to see just that it is now "cool" to be President. Well,....at least according to stations such as VH1, MTV and BET. And of course, our younger generation watch and LIVE by the Idols they see on these shows, so of course, what these shows portray MUST be true, and MUST be LAW!!!!!!

Sheesh!!

I'm gonna staop here because I'm tired from the long weekend and I'm afraid that what I'm really trying to say is going to get conveluted and my points are going to come off as something else.

Ugh!!

Politics!!!

This world we live in is so......

I don't know.

[touche22]

Originally Posted by glassdancer

this is gonna get sticky real fast.

Nah....I'm done. After I wrote that I started to think a lot about going through the debris at ground zero. I don't feel like arguing anymore. I'm thinking more about

DAZZLER IN 2010!!!

[Argonus]

We definitely have more enemies than allies thanks to Bush's decisions now, Steve.. I totally agree.

We saw that first-hand when Cyn and I went to Spain when Bush declared war on Iraq.. Spain's President supported Bush, Spain's PEOPLE were in the streets with signs and torches (pretty much) in protest against Spain's President's decisions.

We got evacuated, and Cyn did all the speaking, since she knew their tongue, and my Spanish is rusty.

[Argonus]

I think we're on the same page anyways, we're just reading different paragraphs.

Originally Posted by touche22

Nah....I'm done. After I wrote that I started to think a lot about going through the debris at ground zero. I don't feel like arguing anymore. I'm thinking more about

DAZZLER IN 2010!!!

[glassdancer]

Originally Posted by Argonus

I understand what you're saying, Luis.. but holding Obama to some "higher standard" than we've held other Presidents to, merely because he's African-American, isn't fair to Obama.. quite honestly.

He's opening the eyes of a lot of people that thought they'd never amount to anything, etc., due to their race/economic status/etc.. that by no means should be downplayed, but we also shouldn't expect the man to fix things overnight, as that's not a fair assumption to be placed on his, or any President's, shoulders.

My wife is seeing him as "JFK'-type of President, and I'd have to agree. The man is someone I could talk to about Bowen Statues, or surfing, and he'd be genuinely interested.. and give his own, engaging input. Then this same man would go to an impoverished neighborhood and try and raise their spirits there through a rally, or efforts to renovate their community center or something.

Obama seems to think big and small... I'm just hoping he continues that line of thinking. All indications point to that he will.

I'm from a military family, and two wealthy families.. even so, even with my supporting of Bush (even though that's lessened hugely the last couple of years).. I totally see the hope a President like Obama brings to so many people in this country, and I'm hardly the person to say it's unwarranted.

This guy being President has uplifted more people than any other candidate I've seen in my lifetime, and that's saying something. His ethnicity is a distant (yet just as significant) second to that.

Fair enough!

Dazzler in 2010!!!!

And Steve for President!!

Hey Steve,......

did you get my payment for those books..?????

[bat_collector]

hey guys, hope you are all ok